The inRide Bluetooth Smart accessory (tiny pod above) is the first Bluetooth Smart power meter to hit the market, just ahead of other Bluetooth Smart power meters. Now, some might finagle with the terminology around ‘power meter’, but since it’s ultimately giving you a metric of power, I’m sticking with that term for now.
The inRide is an interest blend of a product compared to most. Unlike an accessory that works with every bike, it’s focused on just the Kurt Kinetic lineup of trainers. However, in doing so they’ve been able to craft a product that ‘just works’ since it only has to work on a small subset of units. But how does it compare to the many software applications on the market that already estimate power for the trainer using known power curves and speed data? Well, I set to find out.
And find out I did. It took WAY more time than I expected. Almost two months longer in fact. I’ve had a unit since late October, but it hasn’t been until recently that the final software version has been available. And before publishing my results, I wanted to ensure we weren’t dealing with beta issues.
So…how did things turn out? Well, let’s find out.
Unboxing:
The inRide accessory is of course meant to attach to one of the Kurt Kinetic trainers. In my case, I happened to purchase the Road Machine trainer last winter, so it’s the one I’m using. I had re-boxed it up in the move to France, so here’s some re-unboxing photos:
The Road Machine trainer comes in about two and half major pieces. You’ve got the stand, and then the flywheel. The ‘half piece’ are the bolts that connects the two.
You’ll attach the three parts together, and it should end up looking roughly like the below. Any other configuration means you’re not off to a good start.
With that, our attention is turned to the inRide. The inRide packaging is about the size of a book, and contains two major components, and then a small bag with a very important magnet and magnet holder.
If you crack open the clamshell plastic inside, you’ll see the inRide Bluetooth Smart accessory in the middle, and the Bluetooth Smart Heart Rate strap on the right.
Or, top and bottom in this case:
Additionally, you’ll find a small manual in it there.
The included Bluetooth Smart heart rate strap is actually pretty good – even if the feedback I hear is that almost nobody seems to want it (read: you want to pay less and use your existing straps). The strap is just the Wahoo Fitness BlueHR strap rebranded with a Kinetic logo on it. This particular strap and the work Wahoo has spent on the firmware virtually eliminate common HR dropouts/spikes from what I’ve seen in testing.
Below is the inRide components that really make this whole operation tick. On the right is the Bluetooth Smart inRide transmitter pod. And to the left is a small magnet and a magnet holder.
At the end of the day, the Bluetooth Smart inRide is really just keeping track of speed and then doing some math to determine power based on a known power curve (and applying the calibration value based on a rolldown). So the roll of the magnet in this case acts exactly like that of a speed sensor normally found on a bike. It’s just that this is measuring the trainer speed, and not your bike wheel speed.
As noted, there are some manuals included. The one to the left is the legit manual. The one to the right basically says not to do anything stupid with the unit. Or not to fall off your bike. And if you do fall off, it’s clearly your fault, not Kinetic’s.
The instruction manual is short and sweet – and pretty easy to follow. Fear not, I’m going to walk through it all together here anyway.
Setup and Magnets:
I’m going to assume you already unpacked your trainer and have it setup.
The inRide piece is what I’m going to focus on. Ultimately, you’re goal here is to get that magnet, into that hole. The good news is that they make it pretty easy.
First, start with the hole:
Now take the rubber thingy, and stick it in the hole. It only goes in one way. So if it’s not going in, you’re doing it wrong. Think back to putting the round peg in the round hole as a kid, not the square peg.
They recommend using a screwdriver to bonk it in. Worked for me.
Whack!
Next, take the other end of that flat-blade screwdriver. Attach the magnet to it (it’s magnetic, that magnet, it’ll automatically attach). Then position it above the hole:
Push it into the hole. See, magic - magnet in the hole:
Now, undo the sticky on the back of the plastic transmitter pod.
Then, stick it onto the back of the unit. Ensure that the writing isn’t upside down, and ensure it’s as close as possible to the right side of the wheel and the magnet as possible. You don’t want it touching, but you want it BFF.
If you listen carefully, you’ll hear a little ‘click…click….click’ each time the magnet passes the sensor. If you don’t hear this, consider putting your ear closer. If you still don’t hear this…something be wrong.
With that set, we’re good to start using it!
(Geeky Sidebar follows, not part of the production final release)
Now in the course of testing this product I learned a few things about the magnets. See, on the first prototype I received there wasn’t actually the small magnet holder. Rather, just a little plastic baggie with a magnet in it. That’s how most prototype products arrive to me, just a plastic baggie like I bought it in Chinatown. When I plopped the magnet into the back of the whole, it stuck there quite nicely all by itself. I spun the trainer roller a bit, did some spin-ups, and it seemed to stay – so I thought I was good with my solution.
And, I was.
Mostly.
Then one magic night came along and mid-workout I heard a small twang followed by a ding or two. I didn’t think much about it until about 2-3 seconds later when my speed, cadence and power metrics dropped off mid-ride. It didn’t take long to find out that the magnet had departed. And departed for good. See, behind the trainer was a bunch of boxes, other trainers, and this horrendous straw-mat carpet stuff that’s in our apartment. Finding the tiny magnet proved impossible. Without said magnet, I was hosed.
I ended up going to the hardware store and actually shaving down some other magnets to fit in there. A lot of magnets. It really wasn’t pretty. But it worked! The most important part was then adding a single piece of scotch tape to ensure no further magnet departures would happen.
At the same time as my hardware store excursion, I also went online and found some magnets that fit a bit better, they’re here (you can see I’ve placed the official magnet on top of the middle bottom magnet to show sizing):
So, if you happen to find yourself in the same situation somehow – just find anything that’ll fit in there and is strong enough to trip the sensor (you can hear it click each time it goes past).
Of course, the interesting thing here is that this starts to open the door to non-Bluetooth Smart options. In fact, some folks playing around with Golden Cheetah have been talking about just that. Just taking a standard ANT+ speed sensor and seeing if there’s enough data to do the same. It would lack built-in rolldown calibration (which is what makes this entire solution interesting), though that could potentially be done in software. But that’s a topic for a different day…
Trainers Supported:
The Kinetic inRide supports the following trainers:
Trainer #1: Kurt Kinetic Road Machine
Trainer #2: Kurt Kinetic Road Machine with Pro Flywheel:
Trainer #3: Kurt Kinetic Rock and Roll Trainer:
Additionally, it also supports the Kinetc ProTrainer unit. Note that it really comes down to the magnet hole. If its got a hole, then it can be used (or at least, they can do something with it). The magnet is what allows the sensor to trigger your speed, hence the criticality.
The Kinetic App:
Now that we’ve got everything all setup, let me walk you through some regular usage of the complete solution. First though, you’ll need to download the Kinetic inRide app. Fear not, it’s free. You can just search for ‘inRide’ and it’ll be the first thing you find (well, at present it is anyway):
App Install:
Pairing with Bluetooth Smart Sensors:
Once you open up the app you’ll need to pair it with your inRide device. To do so, you’ll go ahead and hit the configuration button:
Then tap ‘Add New’ to start the sensor addition process:
We’ll go ahead and add the ‘inRide Watt Meter’ first, which will then hopefully find the sensor. Be sure to give the flywheel a quick roll to make the click…click…click sound, which wakes up the sensor. Otherwise it won’t pair.
Once it shows up, you can name it if you’d like, though since you can only add one sensor in the app – there’s not really any point. If you happen to have the Pro Flywheel, then go ahead and click ‘On’ next to that. Otherwise, leave things as is.
Now, repeat the same process for the Bluetooth Smart heart rate strap:
With that, you’ll see both sensors within the ‘Sensors used’ area, and you’ll be ready to roll (quite literally)!
Workout Options
Now, there are a few things you can change if you’d like to in the settings. First, you can modify your profile information (weight/height/etc…) to get better calorie information.
Then, you can choose which pages you’d like to add to the screen. You can modify them in any way, but you can at least turn some on/off:
Down below you can select whether or not to auto-pause (pauses the unit if you stop riding), or whether you want a countdown.
Lastly, you can also enable triggers within the app. These typically audibly announce certain things, or trigger other items such as music playing or laps being specified.
Starting Ride and Calibration:
With all that taken care of, let’s ride. When you first start the app up, it’ll look just like the below – likely with no watts being displayed unless you’re already pedaling:
Shortly after you start, you want to calibrate. Now technically you want to calibrate a bit later as well – as that’s most important. But I find that I get the best results by calibrating twice, once at the beginning, and once at the 10-minute marker after things have warmed up.
To calibrate, you simply pedal to 23MPH, and then stop pedaling. Don’t pedal anymore, otherwise it’ll mess up calibration. If it succeeds, you’ll get a ‘Spindown Calibration Complete’ message. If however, your wheel is too loose, or something else amiss, it’ll give you a failure notification. But for me, it’s all success:
Now perhaps the most important calibration is the one you do have 5-10 minutes (I find 10 minutes to be most effective). This is perfect, as it allows you a proper warm-up (2 minutes isn’t a proper warm-up, and neither is 5 minutes). Simply do it again, and you’ll be good to go.
I can’t stress how important calibration is. At the end of the day, the SOLE reason you are buying inRide is for this feature. That’s it.
Seriously.
There are probably a dozen apps out there that can utilize your trainer speed to determine the power curve, but NONE of them have calibration – which means they are typically off by 15-50 watts. This feature is what makes it off only perhaps +/-1%. So if you don’t use this functionality, you’re essentially wasting $200. Again, it only takes about 15 seconds.
With that set, time to use the app!
Switching screens
Once you’re riding, the workout is really up to you from a structure standpoint. The unit doesn’t provide any training plans, as it’s more of a training tool than a coach. Similar to any other trainer or power meter.
The training screens allow you to view not only instant power/cadence/heart rate/speed/distance information, but also more advanced metrics. For most though, you’ll probably hang out on this particular screen:
In addition they offer mean/max (mean maximal) power information as well on the second screen (well, technically it’s the third screen, but the first screen is really to just control music, so hence it’s the second data screen). You can see my max numbers for the time chunks listed on the right side (i.e. 5 minutes at 216w). This wasn’t a particularly tough workout, hence you see the drop pretty quickly at the 20 minute mean-max. Also note the TSS, NP and IF information displayed here as well. It’s not clear if this is ‘close to’ the official Training Peaks formulas, or if they’ve partnered such that it’s exactly the same.
The next page includes time in zone information. You’ll note that the current information is still displayed on the left, so you don’t have to constantly swap back and forth.
Then we have a page focused more on heart rate:
With the same time in zone info displayed for heart rate as well:
Finally, you’ll have noticed there’s the big lap and pause button on each page. The pause does exactly what you’d think it does…pauses. The lap button will demark a lap that can then later be retrieved using just about any software out there, allowing you to further analyze that segment.
When you press lap, it’ll give you a summary of the past lap (though, oddly, not average power for that lap).
But I can swipe to the right and view the current laps (intervals) and see the stats about it. You’ll see the current interval displayed, as then you can scroll down and see previous intervals.
Completing your ride and uploading history:
Once you’ve completed you’re ride, you can go ahead and tap pause, then stop, which will allow you to Save it. Obviously, it would seem kinda silly not to save it.
Upon saving you’ll be given you’re workout summary details, where you can also dive into the laps if you’d like.
Then, you can click to share the workout. For example, you can e-mail the results back to you (it attaches a bunch of file types that upload to just about any platform on earth). Or, you can configure sharing to just take care of the uploading for you.
Below are the platforms you can configure on the sharing front. For example, I usually upload to Training Peaks as well as Garmin Connect – since then I have easy copies of the data accessible to me.
This is one of the biggest reasons I love the Wahoo Fitness app (just rebranded here), as it doesn’t discriminate when it comes to who I can upload to. It just does its job and uploads where I want it.
inRide Power Meter Accuracy Tests:
I’ve spent a LOT of time in this particular area. In fact, the sole reason this review wasn’t published back during the first week of November is due to this section. Initially during the beta portion I had a lot of problems with accuracy. Thankfully the team figured out the root of those issues, and once that was resolved – it’s been rock-star solid since. It was like turning a switch from bad to perfect.
That said, power meter accuracy tests are the bane of my existence. I generally dislike completing them. Primarily because there are so many factors that go into it from performing perfect calibrations to trying to gather data across multiple head units and power meters. It’s not as easy as you might then when you’re trying to make it repeatable and scalable (if it was, then you’d see others doing it). Then there’s all the slicing and dicing of the data afterwards to make it look pretty. No such app exists that does it all for me.
For all of the numbers you’ll see below, all data is from a final production unit (actually purchased through a normal distributor), as well as the final inRide app as available on the iTunes store. There are no beta test hardware/software figures below.
For these tests, I was using the following equipment: Kinetic inRide, CycleOps PowerTap G3, Power2Max (New late 2012 edition).
Between those three units you can pretty easily start to establish clear trending and accuracy information. In all tests, there was a 10-minute warm-up period, followed by a recorded calibration across all power meters. By ‘recorded calibration’ I mean that I didn’t stop recording, hence why you see the calibration spikes across all devices at the same time. I record this data because it makes analysis much easier than trying to align gaps (read: once you start recording, don’t stop!).
Test #1:
Each test I did is essentially just a trainer workout that I had planned. They tend to have a wide variety of components in them from steady-state to drills to warm-up and cool-down.
The results are pretty clear, it’s interesting to see the pre-calibration pieces, and then it all come together at about the 10-minute marker for calibration:
Here’s the graph to go with it.
Again, seeing fairly solid results within a couple watts in some cases, and thus easily within a couple percent in most cases. As noted before, each power meter tends to be accurate within 2% (as rated), but which one is ‘the most absolute accurate’ on any given day is rather difficult to achieve in a normal training setting. So if I can get three power meters to agree within in some cases 3 watts – I’m having a pretty darn good day. Obviously, the fact that they are each measuring at different points (crank/hub/tire) should also be noted, so you will see some discrepancies there (typically you lose power as you go further from the crank due to drivetrain, etc…).
Test #2:
These were mostly higher cadence workouts working on the aerobic side of things – so some of the wattages are a bit lower. Nonetheless, you’re seeing the same trend here:
And pretty similar here:
Cadence Accuracy
While the power accuracy is pretty spot on, I am seeing issues with cadence accuracy. In two ways actually.
First, is that on average, it measures about 5-8% higher than reality. If you look at how inRide is measuring cadence, it’s pretty much working at the problem backwards mathematically trying to determine what your stroke is doing based on increases in power. So it’s already a bit of a guess. But in this case, I see that on average if my cadence is really 80RPM, then inRide might report 84-88RPM. It’s steady, and not jump on the screen – but steadily off.
But what’s even more interesting though is to look at the actual numbers being recorded under the covers. That tells the real story of what’s going on. Here are three separate cadence measurements from three sources:
Check out the Kinetic cadence – it’s bouncing all over the place, even though my cadence is holding near perfectly at 79RPM (revolutions per minute). You see some slight fluctuations from the PowerTap cadence, but that’s also a normal for it given it’s not measuring it directly at the crank, but rather indirectly through the hub.
In my case, cadence is a big part of many of my trainer workouts, so I really wish that the inRide app would allow me to pair to other speed/cadence sensors (for reasons unclear to me, they actually removed this functionality). Of course, fixing the actual problem of the cadence being off may be a bit harder to solve.
3rd Party Options: TrainerRoad:
In addition to the default app, there is at present one additional application that will work with the inRide – and that’s TrainerRoad. TrainerRoad is a desktop (PC or Mac) application that guides you through a given trainer workout using power zones. They have a platform of trainer workouts (hundreds, actually, 327 as of this morning) that both them and folks have created that you can open up and complete. Once you complete the ride, it’ll upload it to their online site.
Now the application doesn’t attempt to keep you busy/entertained through 3D graphics or the like, rather, it’s more about hitting the exact power levels that its prescribing to you. It has become pretty popular in the last year because of their ability to work with a gazillion trainers. You typically will use your existing ANT+ Speed sensor and ANT+ USB stick, and based on that it can give you a ‘Virtual Power’ number for many of those trainers. And while the virtual power number can be a bit fuzzy accuracy-wise, it does tend to be consistent (assuming everything else is constant).
With that brief overview out of the way, let’s dive into how it can connect with the inRide platform (no ANT+ required) to work.
TrainerRoad Pairing with Kinetic inRide
First is the pairing with the inRide. Now normally (previous to this), you’d have an ANT+ stick plugged in. But as you can see from the photo below, I don’t (which is why it says “Search for ANT+ USB”). Meaning that everything I’m about to show is all Bluetooth Smart.
In this case, the MacBook I’m demo’ing this on is Bluetooth 4.0 capable. In fact, most recent Mac’s are. If you don’t have a recent Mac, you can use the $10 IOGear Bluetooth 4.0 USB adapter to get the same functionality. And while that USB stick is PC compatible, the stars haven’t aligned yet for TrainerRoad to take advantage of that – so you’ve got to wait a short bit longer (though that is their goal).
Ok, at any rate…pairing.
To pair to the inRide ensure that your Kinetic App on the iPhone is turned OFF (killed/closed/not running). This is critical. Otherwise, TrainerRoad can’t connect to the inRide. Also, be sure to spin the wheel a few times.
With that set, go ahead and search. When it finds the unit, it’ll pair with it and then the ‘unpair’ option will appear. You can then repeat the process for the heart rate strap. Additionally, if you’ve picked up the Wahoo Blue SC, you can do the same there as well.
Now the cool thing here is that unlike the Kinetic app, you can mix and match ANT+ devices. For example, if I wanted to use an ANT+ speed/cadence sensor to get better cadence data – no problem. Or if I for some reason wanted to use any other ANT+ device, I can combine them together as I see fit:
TrainerRoad Use
This isn’t a full review of TrainerRoad, so I’m just going to move pretty quickly through these sections.
In order to ride a given workout, you’ll go to the ‘Workouts’ tab and search for a workout. You can also do this online and sift through the workouts there. They have both generic workouts as well as video workouts. When I’m just doing a workout of my own, I use the ‘Free’ workouts – literally called ‘Free 30’, ‘Free 60’, etc… Which is just a blank slate of 30, 60, etc… minutes that will record the data as-is.
In the case of this, I’m going to actually do a video. The videos pull from popular videos like Sufferfest and others. You simply go in and search for whichever video you purchased from them. In my case, I bought the Revolver video. So I searched for it below, and then tagged it as a favorite so I could easily find it again in my favorites menu (the third tab).
Once I’ve selected a workout, it’ll load up the workout onto the screen. Now videos actually show a bit different, so let me first show you what a regular workout looks like. In this case – the ‘Disaster’ workout. You can see the blue chunks. These indicate differing power levels. Everything in TrainerRoad is based on FTP – Functional Threshold Power – or essentially the max wattage you could hold for 60 minutes. Then, based on that the workout shifts different sections as a percentage of that power.
Fear not, if things are too hard or too easy you can shift the % button at the button to scale the workout easier or harder (as I’ll show you in a second).
Ok, with that, I had my video (Revolver) all loaded up. You’ll point TR at the video and then it will automatically pull in the video into the TrainerRoad screen – allowing you to pretty much see everything at once.
Below, I’m at the beginning during a short warm-up. You can see the intensity level is displayed as 4/10 on the right side.
As I work through the video, it’ll automatically display the recommended intensities on top of the video itself in TrainerRoad. These have then been converted into the workout charts that you see along the bottom of the screen.
As you go through the workout, it’ll be constantly shifting per the video. You can see below, a case of effort of 10/10 – which in my case has a ‘target power’ of 293w, and I’m currently fairly close at 300w.
Of course, this is about as close to 100% I can get while also taking photos and screenshots of the review at the same time (assistant I have not).
If you look at the below, there’s a few things of note. First is that I’m a bit high in the wattage – 340w vs the target of 293w. So unlike above, that bar is now orange instead of green. Also, you’ll see I’ve got 30 seconds left in this interval. That’s shown both on the screen (middle) as well as lower down within interval time. And, if you look close enough you’ll even see it in the tiny charts that I’m half-way through that interval.
You can pause the video at any time by either pressing pause on the keyboard, or you can also go ahead and have TrainerRoad use an option that triggers pauses based on when you stop pedaling.
TrainerRoad Uploading Workouts and History:
Once you’re done suffering, you’ll be given a summary screen of your workout. From there it’ll automatically upload to the site where you can view it there as well. In that same location, you can download the .TCX file which you can upload to any 3rd party site pretty easily.
Now, since I know some of you will analyze the below with incredible attention to detail and wonder what exactly was going on.
See, this workout was back in early November. In my TR profile, I have it set for an FTP of about 315w. This means that for each of those 16 intervals it wanted me to put out 400w for 60 seconds. Perhaps that was optimistic this time of year, but, that wasn’t actually the root of my problem.
My problem was that early on at that beta stage (again, it’s fine now in production) the calibration factor of the inRide was off. Off by about 20-30% depending on where you were (it got worse the higher your wattage). Which meant that when I was putting out say 400w of power (as recorded by two other power meters), the inRide would say I was closer to 320w. Which means that in order to put out 415w that was required for this workout, I actually had to put out almost 500w of power. For 60 seconds. For 16 intervals.
As you can see below, that didn’t happen.
Luckily, TrainerRoad has that little % adjustment option which allowed me to pull it down to a more reasonable value, which you can see I started to do on #2, and by #4 I had found a functional value. Of course, all of the numbers below are reported based on the skewed power numbers, so I didn’t ‘get credit’ for the actual power numbers in this case. But, I did get a funny story. And again, it’s all resolved now, but I thought you’d find it entertaining.
One thing I do want to ensure is clear is that in the case of the Kinetic inRide or Kinetic Road Machine, TrainerRoad can’t control the trainer resistance. That’s done by you changing gears. Meaning that there is no electronic control that takes it from 200w to 500w – that’s you and you’re gearing/cadence that does that.
TrainerRoad with the Kurt Kinetic in Trainer Road ‘Virtual Power’ configuration
Now one big question a lot of folks have is whether or not TrainerRoad’s Virtual Power is as accurate as inRide power, and how the two compare. Remember Virtual Power uses trainer speed and works on hundreds of trainers, no inRide required. But there’s also no spindown/rolldown calibration capability, meaning they can’t determine the impact of tire pressure or other environmental items (such as the trainer heating up) that would impact accuracy.
Just to make sure we’re on the same page:
TrainerRoad Virtual Power = Using non-inRide speed sensor to predict power (hundreds of trainers)
TrainerRoad with Kinetic inRide = Using inRide sensor to predict power (just Kinetic Trainers)
I’m simply comparing one method versus another because it’s the most requested question I get. That’s all.
So I did one ride where I had my PC paired using the ANT+ option to just track speed like everyone else is doing today, and then on the Mac I had it paired to the inRide which supports calibration (even in TrainerRoad). Here’s the quick results:
As you can see, Virtual Power tracks well until the point of calibration, but that lack of calibration is what pulls it further from reality – which is particularly noticeable as the unit warms up. Once I do the calibration on inRide (those quick spikes you see at about the 25% marker), that’s when things separate as TrainerRoad Virtual Power doesn’t know about that in the regular non-inRide mode. Hence the differential of about 20-40w from there on out.
Again, there’s nothing wrong with Virtual Power from the standpoint of it being cheaper than a power meter and still offering some level of value in relation to the TR platform. However, it’s clear there’s also value in the accuracy of the inRide.
Bluetooth Smart Notables:
Now there are some minor notables with a Bluetooth Smart device that you should be aware of. Most of these aren’t an issue, but it’s important you’re aware of them (especially the first two paragraphs below) – otherwise you could be up a creek without a paddle.
Bluetooth Smart is a subset of the Bluetooth 4.0 standard. These devices started coming onto the market in Late 2011 with the iPhone 4s, and then since about mid-2012 have become pretty standard in mobile devices. A Bluetooth 4.0 enabled device can then talk to Bluetooth Smart sensors. An older Bluetooth enabled device (such as the iPhone 3G) can’t understand or even talk to the new Bluetooth Smart devices. So, it’s important you have a new device if you’re going to use inRide.
In the case of the Kinetic inRide app, you’ll need an iOS device (iPad/iPhone/iSomething). It’s simply that the app isn’t written for any other platforms (Android/Windows Phone/Blackberry). This likely comes from the fact that the app is essentially the Wahoo Fitness app stripped down and rebranded, and that app at present is only on iOS. Now, iOS isn’t a requirement for the inRide. In fact, if you look at TrainerRoad, it’s not iOS based. It’s both Mac and PC (though, the PC part of inRide isn’t quite there yet because the drivers aren’t quite worked out yet – soon though).
With the Bluetooth Smart heart rate strap that’s included, it requires a Bluetooth Smart Heart Rate Strap enabled app. Meaning that many of the older apps that haven’t been updated actually won’t see the strap – even if they support Bluetooth devices. Newer and more popular apps tend to support the Bluetooth Smart straps – but you may want to check with your app (if you use something different for cycling outdoors/running/etc…) to validate that support Bluetooth Smart straps. As I noted earlier, it’s actually a pretty solid strap – so there is some benefit there.
As noted earlier, the device isn’t ANT+ capable, and despite a lot of asking, it doesn’t sound like it’s something that Kinetic is interested in bringing to market. Which is ultimately too bad as I believe it artificially restricts how many people would pick one up. I think what we may see instead is folks look to leverage this same concept using a standard ANT+ speed sensor (at 1/8th the price) and bring apps to market that support it (with roll-down). Again, we’ll see.
Finally, the other notable on Bluetooth Smart is that you can’t multi-pair a device. Meaning that you can’t have two head units connected to the same inRide sensor. For example, on ANT+ you can pair two Garmin’s (such as a bike and run Garmin) to the same heart rate strap or sensor. On Bluetooth Smart, it’s a 1:1 relationship. It’s not an issue for 95% of the people out there, but for that remaining 5%, it can be.
Summary:
If you look at the inRide device’s objectives, it had one primary object: Be accurate with power measurements. Everything else was secondary to that. If it wasn’t accurate then it was pointless to buy. Luckily, the power accuracy is pretty much spot on. In fact, I’d even go as far as saying it seems easier to keep in check than some power meters are.
The secondary objectives would be ease of setup, simplicity of the app to use, and the ability to get the data out of the app and into other platforms. In that area, it again does well. By leveraging the Wahoo app they were able to take a ‘known good’ and re-skin it to be Kinetic. They did remove a few things that they deemed unnecessary (such as Speed/Cadence sensor support), which is too bad, as that would have addressed the cadence accuracy issues I’ve seen. I don’t consider those cadence issues a show-stopper for most, but they are annoying. And supporting the Bluetooth Smart Speed/Cadence sensor would have provided an option for folks where it is a showstopper.
Pros:
- Cheaper than a full power meter if you already have a Kinetic Trainer
- Very accurate power measurements
- Contains rolldown/calibration functionality
- Compatible with 3rd parties (uses standardized power meter profile for BLE)
- Easy to use app (free app), good export options
Cons:
- Not ANT+ comaptible
- Requires Bluetooth 4.0 device
- Cadence isn’t super-accurate
Here’s a comparison chart that’s dynamically updated with all trainers that are either in the market that I’ve reviewed, or pending for review. In general, I don’t put trainers in here that I haven’t personally ridden in some way. However, because of the significant interest around KICKR in there I’ve placed KICKR in there with a bunch of TBD/TBA notations as applicable. As information trickles in, these get automatically updated.
| Function/Feature | Kurt Road Machine (with inRide) | LeMond Revolution | BKOOL Trainer | Wahoo Fitness KICKR | Tacx Bushido |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Copyright www.DCRainmaker.com - Updated March 5th, 2013 @ 8:58 amNew Window Expand table for more results | |||||
| Price for trainer | $199 + $340 | $499 | €500 | $1,099.00 | $940 |
| Is Software Bundled for free? | Yes | N/A | Yes | Yes | No |
| Cost of software if not bundled | N/A | N/A | N/A | N/A | $185 |
| Cost of software if monthly-based | N/A | N/A | €5-10 | N/A | N/A |
| Available today (for sale) | Available today | Yes | Available today | Arrives March 5th, 2013 | Available today |
| Availability regions | Global | Global | Europe | US/Canada | Global |
| Connects to computer | 3rd Party Required | No | Yes | 3rd Party Required | Yes |
| Uses mouse/keyboard as control unit | 3rd Party Required | No | Yes | 3rd Party Required | Yes |
| Has standalone control unit (handlebar) | 3rd Party Required | Yes, seperately | No | No | Yes |
| Uses phone as control unit (handlebar) | Yes (with inRide) | No | No | Yes | No |
The way I look at it is that if you already have a compatible Kurt Kinetic trainer, then the inRide is a relatively cheap method of getting fairly accurate power measurements for it – at least cheap compared to a full blown direct force power meter. However, on the flip side, if you don’t already have a Kurt Kinetic trainer, then you’re looking at some $550 for the whole combo ($350 for the trainer, $200 for the inRide). At that price, it starts to become a bit tougher of a question. For example, at $699 you’ve got the Stages power meter coming in. And while it may not be 100% as accurate as some power meters due to simply doubling the left-leg power, it would at least allow you to train indoors and out with power (again, accuracy TBD there). If you’re Europe based, then you’ve got the BKOOL trainer as well in that same price range (500 euros). Of course, I think if Kinetic had offered the inRide sensor without the HR strap for $99, there would likely be a lot more people interested in them.
With that, thanks for reading! As always, feel free to leave comments/questions below and I’d be happy to try and answer them as best as possible.
Found this review useful? Here’s how you can help support future reviews with just a single click! Read on…
Hopefully you found this review useful. At the end of the day, I’m an athlete just like you looking for the most detail possible on a new purchase – so my review is written from the standpoint of how I used the device. The reviews generally take a lot of hours to put together, so it’s a fair bit of work (and labor of love). As you probably noticed by looking below, I also take time to answer all the questions posted in the comments – and there’s quite a bit of detail in there as well.
I’ve partnered with Clever Training to offer all DC Rainmaker readers an exclusive 10% discount across the board on all products (except clearance items). You can pickup the inRide below. Then receive 10% off of everything in your cart by adding code DCR10XBK at checkout. By doing so, you not only support the site (and all the work I do here) – but you also get a sweet discount. And, since this item is more than $75, you get free US shipping as well.
Additionally, you can also use Amazon to purchase the unit or accessories (though, no discount on either from Amazon). Or, anything else you pickup on Amazon helps support the site as well (socks, laundry detergent, cowbells). If you’re outside the US, I’ve got links to all of the major individual country Amazon stores on the sidebar towards the top. Though, Clever Training also ships most places too and you get the 10% discount. Thanks for reading!
And as always, feel free to post comments or questions in the comments section below, I’ll be happy to try and answer them as quickly as possible. And lastly, if you felt this review was useful – I always appreciate feedback in the comments below. Thanks! Finally, I’ve written up a ton of helpful guides around using most of the major fitness devices, which you may find useful in getting started with the devices. These guides are all listed on this page here.
Great review, as always. Seems like Nate and Reid from Trainerroad should focus on roll down calibration for their next big release… From what I gather, the inride only has the same speed metric to start from so it’s all just math and software. Well, just…
Thats what I was thinking too. The wheelspeed sensor on my bike already has all the information the inride sensor is picking up, why do I need more hardware? This should have just been a software release.
Yes, they mentioned it on their blog about one year ago link to blog.trainerroad.com and I got an answer in October via Twitter stating “We’re waiting on the inRide so we can compare numbers. We’re working together to make sure our data matches.”
I don’t want to spend 200$ on the inRide (and the useless HR strap) and hope that TrainerRoad can integrate roll-down calibration soon. I would rather save the 200$ and invest in one of the yet to be released power meters.
What the inRide has over our calibration stuff is where it’s measured. They get a much more accurate roll down test because it’s on the resistance unit which has a very small diameter. We’ve tried putting an ANT+ sensor there but the ANT protocol can’t handle updates that quickly.
So for us, we have to do the roll down with the spinning of the rear wheel. Although it seems fast, it takes a while for a wheel to do a full revolution in relation to calibration. So we have to interpolate when we think the wheel actually hits 20 and 10 mph (those are the times we use for the roll down).
That interpolation is where we could have errors. Alas, we will test this fully before we implement (so we get a good DC Rainmaker Review
). Our plans right now is to build it into the software and verify the roll down calibration with all of those power meter owners with kinetic trainers that we have on the site.
With that, we’ll have thousands of “tests” where we can compare VirtualPower, VirtualPower + calibration and a power meter.
Then you start to run into power meter calibration and just different power meters in general. As you’ve probably seen from Ray’s site, two power meters are never the same.
So we want to take these tests and build it into our software so that after we do it for the kinetic trainers, we can branch out to other trainers. As long as we build our software right and take our (reasonable) time, I think we can release something we are confident in.
Okay, that was entirely too long!
As Nate says, The key to a good roll-down calculation is VERY VERY accurate measurement of the deceleration of the rotating mass. If you want a really cool example of roll down in action then take a look at the Concept 2 rowing machines. These are super cool in that they do dynamic roll down calculation; basically as you slide up on the catch the machine knows that the wheel is decelerating and so can re-calibrate. The Concept rowers basically recalibrate their power curve on every stroke meaning that you can change the resistance (drag lever) and it’ll recalibrate the very next stroke. If you display the stroke power curve on the PMx computer then it’s still just doing a velocity/power curve calculation for that, but, the tachometer is super accurate so you get a very accurate (at least a very high resolution) curve.
One question, how does the kinetic speed sensor (the wired wheel magnet unit compare to the new unit here? Is it off by 20-40 watts ? Isn’t trainer road software just matching the watt numbers the kinetic speed sensor?
Great review and largely lead to my decision to purchase! I have the same trainer and followed your setup procedure. I was not able to hear the “click, click” sound but the unit was registering speed and cadence. I had it running next to a Kinetic T-725W and even after successful calibration noticed that the power reading from the Inride was 40 watts lower than the 725 (based on Kurt’s power formula I computed that the 725 is correct). Then 15 minutes into my first use of the device the power reading stopped altogether while speed and cadence continued. I have tried multiple times since then and still cannot get a power reading. Have you heard of this? Kurt is not getting back to me and I cannot find anything on the web about it. If speed is registering then it seems like it is an app issue but a reinstall of the app did not correct the problem. Thanks for any advice you might have!
Thanks for the KK inRide Review.
Any feel for when drivers will be available for the PC crowd? Is this something that TrainerRoad is working on or is it more of an Industry wide project? Just wondering if drivers become available will they work with say PerfProStudio? link to perfprostudio.com or will each software package need to develope their own drivers?
How successful do you feel 3rd party software apps like TR will be at developing a calibration routine? It seems that using a standard speed cadence sensor might not provide enough data points to accurately do the calibration. I’m guessing that’s why KK went with a sensor located on the roller which gives multiple readings per revolution of the rear wheel. Any thoughts on this?
If I remember correctly inRide was origionaly introduced as an Ant+/Bluetooth device. Any indication as to why the Ant+ was dropped?
Looking at your TrainerRoad inRide vs TR Virtual Power it appears by looking at the intervals that the inRide power is not as smooth as the TR Virtual power. Any explaination for this? Is this enough to create significant differences in Normalized Power? Any idea what the PT or other DFPM data would look like? I wonder if inRide would generate the same NP for a set of intervals as the other power sources? I’m guessing that the inRide is some how capable of taking into consideration accelerations and the TR Virtual Power may not. If that’s the case inRide should generate higher NP than TR Virtual Power. Thoughts? Nothing to be concerned about? Even more reason to purchase inRide?
Hey Harry,
We’re not driver guys, Wahoo Fitness helped us with the Mac drivers. So we basically need someone to make Windows drivers for us, someone to help us build it themselves, or someone we can hire to do it.
I actually don’t know enough to say if someone does it once, if it will be available for everyone. If Wahoo makes windows drivers for it, then they should let anyone use it.
For how successful calibration can be on third party apps, you’ve hit the nail on the head. It has to do with where you measure the roll down. Check my previous post to this for more details.
And for your last comment on smoothing, VirtualPower does get smoothed due to us not taking acceleration/deceleration into account. If you’re doing steady state intervals I don’t think this would affect your Normalized Power in a meaningful way. If you were outside doing a road race, then I think this sort of smoothing would have a meaningful effect.
Great write-up with the usual level of depth I’ve come to appreciate.
Harry- I suspect that the relative smoothness is the absence of the rolldown math and relates more to decelleration than jumps . I started power training originally with Virtual Power on TR, and having switched to a Powertap, realized exactly how much momentum plays a part in VP. Stop pedaling at all (zero power) and the trainer (and wheel sensor for VP) continue to turn and read ‘power’ output. Let up for a second with a physical power meter and the numbers show that – even if the wheel is still spinning rapidly.
Seems the inRide is accounting for rolldown (presumably by being more sensitive to small changes in relative wheel speed) while TR is still developing that ability. It reads – correctly – a decrease in speed as resulting from a decrease in applied power.
Either way, one would expect fairly trivial difference in NP from a smoothness standpoint as NP is a smoothing algorithm, but a material difference in NP from persistent the 20-40 watt delta post calibration. That delta is interesting. Given the good match between the inRide and the physical meters, I’d guess that KK has tuned the software very precisely for the power curve and rolldown adjustment. Not surprising – as Ray pointed out TR is trying to support a lot of trainer models while KK can focus with laser precision (and a bigger R&D budget) on a couple of trainers and a single hardware set.
Ray do you have a review with Kurt road machine + ant+ speed/cad ,hrm and golden cheatah in real time mode using virtual power?
Just for comparison with this system
Nice review!
I use GC a lot for analysis (in fact, it’s how I normalize all the data – it’s my best friend for that). But I haven’t used the real time mode too much beyond just toying with it.
My understanding though is that both platforms are using the same power curve data provided by Kinetic, so they’re going to be challenged by the same lack of rolldown option.
Hey Ray, great review as usual.
I don’t have an apple device to pair this with. What is the procedure to perform calibration if I only have a bluetooth adapter on my laptop and paired to trainerroad for example? You didn’t mention how calibration works when not using the app.
Thanks,
zom
If with TrainerRoad, it will automatically calibrate after you let it coast from 20MPH to 10MPH. For me personally, I ride to 23MPH, and then let it coast down to absolute zero movement – just to be sure. The TR guys are going to add in a notification, like the inRide app.
awesome, so I take it the device just senses when you get over a certain threshold speed, and you let it coast down to near zero would be sufficient for calibration, no app needed? If that’s the case I imagine it doesn’t matter what device it’s paired to (if it needs pairing at all) for the calibration to work…
Thanks Ray!
So, it’s more reliable the software that has the best rolldown model, clearly with the sensor on the trainer is easier, but lack in cadence accuracy….. Maybe keeping both is the way to go, since you still need the cadence sensor when you’re off the trainer and for better speed reading, and using the 2nd on the trainer for power. In that side a lot of work for pairing and use all the data together…
Question: it’s possible to use 2 speed/candence sensor (ant+) at the same time??
I’m not aware of any devices that support two concurrent speed/cadence sensors at once, usually you have to pick one.
However, in the ANT+ world (again, brief sidebar), a cadence sensor will in most cases overwrite cadence from a power meter (that’s how the Garmin units work in most situations).
The same logic could be applied by apps/devices in the Bluetooth Smart world.
Later on in the comments, Murray made note that they’ll talk with Kinetic about adding back in the SPD/CAD sensor support (I would presume the Blue SC, which is the Bluetooth Smart version) – which would ‘solve’ the cadence issue.
Great review Ray! What was the tire pressure and knob turns you used when you ran the trainer road virtual power ride?
The tire pressure for this particular wheel set is recommended at between 140 and 160psi, so I aim for 160 simply so I can keep everything consistent.
I did about three turns.
The thing is though, that this particular combo is only applicable to this wheelset and my definition of a turn. That’s the strength of the inRide, in that it removes the error from the equation.
Hey Ray,
Excellent review/info. Did you ever get a chance to find out what the differences are for the Kinetic Wired Power Computer and the inRide? I would hope the inRide is more accurate with less drifting. I’m using the Wireless version of the computer. I tried to contact KK but never got a reply. Thanks…cheers
Steve
Steve
Thanks for the excellent in-depth review, and thanks also to the TR guys for their insightful commentary.
If I hadn’t purchased a Bushido earlier in the year, I’d be giving serious consideration to the KK trainer.
FWIW if you shop around, you can get much better prices that the MSRPs shown in the trainer comparison table. I got my Bushido from a German online retailer and it was around 40% less than the MSRP.
Indeed, especially those outside the US (specifically, for Tacx). Some of the others have more limitations as the various companies have MAP (Minimum Advertised Price) policies.
Why no Android app? They’re missing out on half of their potential market (me included)…
Phil, unfortunately Android does not yet have working Bluetooth Smart drivers. No Drivers means no API and no App (Yet).
We (Wahoo Fitness) have a similar issue with windows drivers, nothing really works yet, until we get good working Bluetooth Smart drivers we can’t create a windows development kit for people like Trainer Road.
These are both things Wahoo is actively working on.
Ray, We will discuss with KK about adding support for Speed+Cadence into the app.
Hi Ray…. In your pictures of the KK machines above for “Supported Trainers”, isn’t Pic #2 the KK Cyclone instead (link to kurtkinetic.com) as opposed to the Pro FlyWheel which in fact is link to kurtkinetic.com
Thank you
MUN
Eek, good catch. Had the wrong pic in there. Swapped it out. Thanks!
Thank you for the great review. I have been looking forward to hearing a more detail about the inride so really appreciate this. The icing on the cake is the 10% off with clever training, never heard of them but ordered the inride with the discount covering the cost of shipping to Canada. Looking forward, sort of, to finding out what my power really is on TrainerRoad hopefully it has been underestimating all this time. Cheers from snowy & cold Alberta.
Great review Ray, thanks.
A very tempting product but as stated it is purely a power output indicator (and I get that).
To make it a no brainer purchase though, it really needs to have an inbuilt test function such that users can self ‘ramp’ test to learn their max power, FTP etc at any point in time and therefore maximise the tool they now own.
Maybe it does have this function and I missed it or maybe Wahoo Murray can advise if this is even possible?
It doesn’t have this function today. It’s something that they could implement. The testing procedures are fairly well known and actually straight forward. Given it would be applicable to not only the Kinetic product, but also the other products that they’re bringing to market (Stages StageONE, Wahoo KICKR, RFLKT), it would make for a good addition.
Thanks in advance Murray.
It would be nice to have some build in test in the app, but currently we don’t have anything.
TrainerRoad lets you run several different types of power tests, they don’t have a Ramp test because they like the other types of test they have, although with the new workout builder it would be a easy setup. This in combination with inRide would give you a accurate FTP value.
Murray
I am confused, if I already have a PM and a kinetic trainer, how can utilize all this fancy software to add valve to my indoor training?
In this case, if you’ve already got a direct force power meter then inRide doesn’t add any value for you. No two ways about it.
Well, I guess if you really wanted that ANT+ power meter data on a phone without an adapter (but the adapter is about $50-60, versus the inRide at $200).
John,
If you already have a power meter, then you can buy a Wahoo Key and use one of several fancy iPhone apps including ours to add value to your indoor training.
Nate, if you need a higher sample frequency for the calibration, couldn’t you have an option for the number of magnets on the spokes and divide speed by that number to give the “true” speed, distance and virtual power?
I’ve done a few bike workouts with my new InRide, and the Kinetic app showed complete data (HR, power, speed, distance, and wildly inaccurate cadence). I love it so far, except for the useless cadence info, but there’s a problem in getting the data to Training Peaks, which I linked to the Kinetic app.
The problem is that only some of my data is making it to Training Peaks. Speed and distance do not appear in the Training Peaks summary or graph, or anywhere else I can see, even though I still see my speed and distance accurately recorded in Kinetic’s app. Those fields on Training Peaks are just blank, even though HR and power and (inaccurate) cadence do appear on TP.
Also, some wattage did not appear on TP for parts of one of the two workouts. I did a calibration to 25 mph (not sure why Ray says 20mph when Kinetic says 25) that required 490-ish watts. TP’s “summary” tab shows the 491-watt max, but the power graph shows a fairly steady line for power at a much lower level. Also, the TP power graph and cadence drop off to zero during my cooldown, when I held 75 watts and 80-ish cadence for the last few minutes.
I realize this may be a Training Peaks issue, but there’s been no response to this issue on TP’s forum. Again, I love the InRide device and the Kinetic app (except for imaginary cadence), but I need to integrate the data with TP for training purposes. Any advice from Ray, Murray or TP would be much appreciated.
Hmm, let me post some workouts to TP here shortly and check it out. Have you opened a support case with TP? Usually they’re pretty quick if so. That said, I’ll poke at it to.
Training Peaks responds:
“It appears that the app is not sending any speed data. I looked at this in TP, WKO, and Notepad++ (see attached). I would recommend contacting Kinitec, or the the maker of the app directly.”
So, can anyone here from Kinetic or Wahoo put this on the to-do list?
The Kinetic App uses the regular TP export that we have had for years, so not sure why it wouldn’t include the Speed/Distance data. I personally don’t have a inRide with me in Australia, I will have a poke around and get get HQ to look into it.
Murray
Thanks, Ray – I’ve been looking forward to the inRide review, and this one was as helpful as ever. I have a clarification question about how the unit compares to others that use a speed-to-power conversion. This review implies that the inRide is simply converting speed to power, with an adjustment factor based on the calibration. That wouldn’t give me much beyond what I already use (speed readout on my Cateye bike computer, plus memorizing the KK speed/power conversion). But my impression from your earlier preview of the inRide, including a demo video at one of the bike shows, was that the unit is doing more. I thought you commented that when you stopped pedaling the unit showed zero watts while the wheel was coasting down. That would imply that the unit is measuring acceleration rather than just speed, and therefore that it’s getting much closer to real power readings than either KK’s old “power meter” or trainerroad. Similarly, it would show much higher wattages than a simple speed/power conversion during initial acceleration. Am I misunderstanding what you showed before?
It’s a bit of both. Speed is used as part of a power curve, by measuring it at the trainer, they get a higher degree of information (smaller circumference). However, there’s also the aspect of understanding that the acceleration plays a roll in roll-down, such that if you stop pedaling it’ll take a second or two before dropping power.
Ah, so that’s what the hole in the roller on my Supermagneto is for, presumably. Maybe Cycleops is also developing something similar?
Hi Ray,
Is that a tubeless or clincher Cyclops G3 wheels on that Kinetic trainer? Which is better, tubeless or clincher wheels?
It’s actually a clincher. I’ve got two different ‘race’ wheelsets on hand. The CycleOps ones (borrowed for testing), which are clinchers, and then a pair of HED3′s, which are tubeless.
I’ve gotta say, I love that I don’t have to ‘worry’ about the clincher side. I’m well versed in swapping them out. But I’ve had one ‘night before the race’ scenario where I managed to cut a hole in one (in my trunk, it caught on a piece of sharp metal), that now you’re worrying about it all and then having a lack of prepared spare.
In general you’re seeing a trend towards clinchers for race wheels these days. These things are up to 160psi – pretty impressive.
Enjoy!
Is there a proceedure to use the spin-down calibration of the InRide and apply to TrainerRoad?
TR will automatically detect it today, it just doesn’t give you a notification of completion. The next build you see from them will have a notification given.
Just had it confirmed by Zackary at Clever Training that they are charging a $29 flat rate fee for std shipping of that palm sized package to Australia – ouch.
To be clear it’s not Clever Trainings fault – USPS & UPS fees are plain silly.
One Kinetic inRide kit ordered
With respect to TrainerRoad, it looks like the device pairing scheme for InRide includes cadence. How do you ensure that the ANT+ cadence/speed sensor is prioritized in terms of the recorded/displayed cadence? Is that just handled automatically by TR?
In TrainerRoad, the priority works like this (from highest to lowest)
Cadence sensor
Speed/Cadence Sensor
Power Meter
So if you had the inride and a speed/cadence sensor paired, we’d display and record the data from the speed/cadence sensor.
This isn’t entirely clear but if I use the inRide unit with TrainerRoad, do I get calibrated power results? If so, I guess the calibration process through the Kinetic iOS app causes an actual calibration on the inRide hardware unit opposed to a software calibration in the iOS app for that to happen?
Yup. In short, today with TrainerRoad and inRide, as long as you do a spin-up (to at least 20MPH), and just let it coast back down to 0, you’re good (you actually need to coast less than that, but I just go all the way down to keep it simple.
The TR app today doesn’t display a calibration message, but the next build will. In short, it’s doing it behind the scenes for now, but shortly it’ll show it as well.
Can you clarify. If I am using TrainerRoad with inRide I am using all Bluetooth with my Mac. Then if I want to get accurate cadence in TrainerRoad am I using Ant+ and need to use an Ant+ dongle to pick up an Ant+ cadence sensor? Like the Garmin speed/cadence sensor. Or am I somehow able to do it all with Bluetooth? I have an older Macbook so I am using the iogear bluetooth 4 adapter.
Thanks.
You could do it with the Wahoo Fitness Blue SC Bluetooth Smart Cadence sensor, which TR will pair to today (with the IOGear adapter for the Older Mac, but you’d need that anyway for inRide).
Or, you could use a USB adapter for ANT+ with an ANT+ Speed/Cadence sensor like the GSC-10.
Essentially, two options, both work. Hope this helps!
I’ve done the calibration procedure three times with no results–I get neither message that it was successful or not successful. Any insight? Set everything up according to your instructions above. Start pedaling, I assume I have to start the timer. Pedal until speed is up to 20 mph then stop pedaling. Then, I sit and wait, and wait, and wait. Nothing.
I also don’t see any calibration instructions on the Kurt Kinetic website for the inRide setup.
Alicia,
If its all working correctly then you should spin up to 25mph the stop pedaling. If you do not get a pass or fail message by the time the tire stops then something is wrong with the set-up. You can find these directions in the Kinetic App by clicking on the wrench, then instructions, then scroll down to Calibrating Your System.
Good luck!
Latest instruction manual here:
link to kurtkinetic.com
Thanks, Bill and Neil. I found the link to the updated manual, and it said to spin up to 23.1 mph, and I see where the instructions in the app itself say 25 mph. In any event, apparently 20 mph wasn’t fast enough. I will try it again tomorrow.
Hi Ray,
Congrats for the review, it’s pretty well written, as always.
I am now wondering: would the inRide sensor work with a Tacx Galaxia roller, or an E-Motion Roller?
I have both here and I would be willing to drill holes on the cilinders of each of them to insert the magnet and see if it works. I would only have to find a DIY way to attach the sensor close to the cilinder/magnet.
But I need to have a clue about how the sensor measures/calculates the power – if it’s related to the cilinder diameter or just the spin speed – and if there’s some other variable to take into consideration.
What do you think?
Best regards,
Carvalho.
An update on the calibration issue: You do have to spin up to 23.1 mph, then stop pedaling for the spindown calibration. Also, calibration may fail if your tire pressure is low. Kurt Kinetic recommends that your road bike tire pressure be around 110 psi (or whatever the recommended pressure is). David Simpson at KK tech support was very helpful.
Anyone else having issues with the calibration failing? I tried it for the first time today, accelerating to 25 mph and the coasting. I did it 3 times during the ride and each time I would get a message that the calibration failed. Everything else seems to work fine (I.e. I get a constant watt readout, so I wouldn’t think I have the sensor misaligned).
Eric, did you check your tire pressure? That fixed my calibration issue.
same issues here. i already contacted the kurt kinetic support and got this answer:
“The calibration speed is 23.1 mph, once you reach this speed a flag is triggered to run the calibration. We are having issues with the inRide calibrating with the Pro Flywheel that we are working thru. If you are getting a calibration failed pop up, then either the L-bolt tension is either too loose or too tight, or the tire is under-inflated.”
so this weekend i gave it almost 20 tries to do a calibration. no success. the tire is 150psi, i tried many positions with the l-bolt tension, i did a complete reset (resetting/flashing firmware, reinstalling the app), i give it a try with my second bike (but it’s a cyclocross bike so a max 80 psi)… no chance. always got the calibration failed pop up. the only thing i didn’t try was to use the original no-pro flywheel. so maybe a calibration with the pro flywheel is simply not possible (at the moment).
alicia, what tire pressure did you use?
update from kurt kinetic support about this problem:
“There is a bug in the Pro Flywheel that we are working thru and should
have fixed soon. It is very hard to get the Pro Flywheel to calibrate
right now and we are recommending that it is left off for right now. I
am the project engineer on the project so I am the most knowledgeable on
this product and I would like to do what I can to help you.”
I’m still having the problem uploading data to Training Peaks from the app. The speed and distance just don’t make the jump, but all the other data seems to be there.
I’m using a workaround where I e-mail all of the data files to myself from the app — the app’s e-mail function sends five different formats of the workout. Then on my computer I log into Training Peaks, where I manually create a new workout and manually upload the “.tcx” file from the e-mail. Not the end of the world, but it’s cumbersome.
At least one other commenter on the Training Peaks forum is having the same problem.
DS, tech support at Kurt Kinetic told me they’re looking to fix that in the next app update.
That’s great news, Alicia. Thanks. Good to know it’s not just mine.
Wow! What a comprehensive review! Good work DC! It’s interesting to see something like this come to market and hopefully push competition in the trainer world. I don’t own a Kinetic trainer but a Cycleops and wish I had something like this on an ANT+ related platform but this looks like a really slick package. I feel it’s a bit spendy but not so in comparison to true power meters.
I wonder if anyone has tried this with the hole in a Cycleops trainer.
Fantastic review – thank you for the effort and time you put into that. I’m a bit hung up on the cadence inaccuracy issue of the inRide, and since cadence is a big part of my training, I’m curious to know how you deal (or dealt?) with it. I’m thinking that I would need to keep relying on my Garmin cadence sensor, and therefore would need to look at both my Garmin and the Kinetic inRide app on the iPhone while working out. Not the most elegant solution, but manageable, I suppose. Any thoughts? Many thanks.
For me, I just use another source (another sensor), and look at it on my Garmin.
I do know that they are looking into it and trying to fix it. I can’t remember who exactly noted it to me in the last month or so, but it was on their list to nail down.
Another great review!
I’ve recently started using InRide with TrainerRoad. Everything has been working fine, but in the last two rides my watts reading are all over the place (0 to 15000!) At first I thought it might be a TR issue, but it happens in the app too.
I’ve tried to flash the sensor according to the new manual’s instructions, but that doesn’t solve the problem. In fact, when trying to flash the sensor, the wattage number does not “blink and briefly display two minus symbols” as described in step 6 of the instructions for flashing/resetting the sensor. Could this mean there’s a problem with the sensor?
By the way, my HR monitor works fine. And the speed/cadence is showing up as well.
Anyone else experiencing this problem?
Thanks!
I saw what you saw once. The way I got out of it was to try and calibrate…I think it took about 2-3 times until it ‘stuck’ and gave me normal values. I’d be curious if the calibration says it succeeded or not.
In general, when you see crazy-high numbers like that for power, it means that something in the calibration is off – which throws the simple speed to power math equations off.
Calibration is not possible with the Pro flywheel even if it is selected under inRide settings/profile- I spoke with KK and they are aware of the issue (something to do with spindown time) and they will be releasing an fix (App update) to solve the problem. Until then this product is not calibration compatible with the heavier flywheel.
Did they indicate a time frame for the update K S?
I’ve got an InRide arriving soon, my KK has the Pro flywheel and from reading this review proper calibration is key to its accuracy.
No timeframe given for the update, but may be time to start pestering
Ivo, sorry, I never came back to this thread until today. Looks like KK gave you an answer and it’s the pro flywheel, but in case anyone else is wondering, I inflated to 110 psi.
Great Review DC
I’m currently using the inRide. The cadence values are all over the place on the inRide app as you reported. (the post ride averages are ok, but jumping about all over the place during the ride isn’t great and the recorded trace is tosh)
I’ve taken to using the Wahoo fitness app in preference to the official inRide app. I pair my Garmin GSC10 for cadence reading. The only thing lacking is the calibration notification. Calibration does occur though – i.e. pedalling at a constant speed pre and post calibration results in different power readings. I’m guessing the calibration occurs in the sensors firmware.
I’ve got a windows PC so I can’t take advantage of trainer-road with the inRide which is a shame (I still use TR but I just factor the workout to be equivalent to my inRide at FTP).
I think you might see the calibration notifications pop-up here as they add in the KICKR pieces to the Wahoo app over the next few days (since, it shares the same power profile).
No joy with the latest app update, never-mind. I did un-pair and re-pair the sensor – which now gets recognised as “inRide 4″. The calibration notification doesn’t happen though, and the calibration option (as presented in your kickR review) doesn’t appear for the inRide. Maybe in the next update.
I get the calibration failed message using the inride app. I don’t know why it keeps failing
Roller-Tyre tension too loose / tight? For me 3 turns is good but if I use 2 turns it won’t calibrate.
I’ve noticed something odd on a few rides using the Kinetic app — the HR and power files do not always line up properly. Yesterday, for example, I did a really hard one-minute interval in the middle of an otherwise steady-state workout, adding 100 watts for the interval. Looking at the graph on Training Peaks, the wattage surge and the HR surge are over two minutes apart — I’m not talking about not the usual lag of HR compared to power, but a complete mismatch of the data.
And curioser, at the end of the workout, I’ve got 2-3 minutes of actual HR data with flatline cadence, power and speed.
Ray, I think the “pause” feature might be pausing the recording of some data and not others, because I paused during my warmup to adjust fans and heater — that gap in the data roughly corresponds to the later mismatch. In fact, my calibration HR and power don’t match up a scant 10 minutes into the workout, so the mismatch exists at that point.
FYI, I manually uploaded a .tcx file from the Kinetic app via e-mail, because the auto-upload to Training Peaks still cannot import speed and distance data. I’m not sure if other file formats carry the same error.
Yeah, I see that as well, but wasn’t sure if it was just me. I also wasn’t sure if it was the pause, or the calibration that causes it to ‘slide’ the data.
After some more testing, I think the data “slide” on the TP graph is caused by pausing the app. I’ve done a few recent workouts in which I calibrated early in the ride and did not use the pause feature, and there was no mismatch of the HR/power/speed lines shown on the graph.
I also did an interval ride with an early calibration and several hard intervals later in the ride, and the periodic power spikes matched the speed spikes and the HR increase.
Now I’m wondering why I don’t just use the full Wahoo app, since it seems to have added spindown calibration and gets a little more attention from the developers.
Do you have a link to the wahoo ap?
Within the app store, just search for “Wahoo Fitness”, should be the first app, by Wahoo Fitness. It’s free.
a little update for everybody who’s got the calibration issue with the
pro flywheel. just got an e-mail from the kurt kinetic support:
“We have been extensively testing an update to the software that was
released to Apple last night, it can take Apple a week to go thru their
approvals but it should be available soon. You will be able to use the
Pro Flywheel and there are many other new features and fixes in it.”
The Wahoo App does not have a calibration built into it to do the spin down required for the InRide, that is only for the KICKR. The latest InRide app is now available on the App Store (Version 1.3) and it includes:
Support for Pro Flywheel
Pro Flywheel calibration fixed
Removed automatic calibration: calibration now starts manually by selecting the “circle-arrow C” icon in the top right of the workout screen; includes onscreen-instructions
Improved real-time cadence display values
Improved file export
Fixed MapMyFitness and Training Peaks uploading issues
Thanks, just downloaded and will test it out later. Looks like a promising update!
I tried out the updated InRide app this morning, and it seems to work great! The auto-export to Training Peaks is now sending all of the data, not just parts. The data “slide” problem when pausing a workout is completely gone.
And a nice surprise: the cadence really does work better. Not perfect like a real cadence sensor, but the real-time display is closer to reality and my post-ride review of TP’s graph shows a much steadier “cadence line” — it now bounces around in a range of maybe 5 rpm and is much closer to actual cadence.
This type of app is exactly what the guys at Lemond need to build for the Revolution rather than wasting time on the power pilot. Just need to use the existing ANT+ sensors and a wahoo iphone dongle and theyre all set.
Benefit for them would be next to zero hardware development, all app time.
Yup, I completely agree. And, I think they do too…
Having read the reviews here ( I regard Ray’s as the BEST and still do !! ) I went and bought the InRide. 6 days later I’ve all but given up on the app ! Calibration seems to fail randomly, it doesn’t even show your speed when you’re trying to reach the spin down speed. Wattage drops in and out, App crashes, and power is al over the place. I’ve reset, reinstalled, tried every PSI and blot tension under the sun, and still cant get a reliable performance from the app. I wasn’t expecting miracle for the money but this is a joke. I emailed KK on day one and I still have heard nothing back, hence I’m posting here. It take a LOT to make me mad enough to post a moan online, but this one leaves me no choice.
Trainer Road on the other hand have been fantastic ! Chad has sent me the latest Betas and given tons of advice, and if it were not for the support from Trainer Road, I would have sent the InRide back.
Now the next and probably most important question, is it accurate ? I can only speak about the Trainer Road implementation as the Kurt Kinetic InRide app quite frankly in its current version is not for for release.
Its my experience that is pretty good up to about 220 Watts drifting a bit the higher the power but only by 7-9 watts, and then it really starts to drift, at 250 Watts its out by over 20W and above 300 its out by 30W, so 10% accuracy seems to be what I’m consistently getting. This was tested against a new PowerTap and a Rotor Power Crank which tracked each other perfectly ( after calibration of course ).
So the reality from my observation is that its really not suitable if you want accurate FTP testing, as you could be out by 30+ Watts which is HUGE for that purpose, and there also is no guarantee that it will be out by the same amount consistently.
I tried multiple roll down calibrations on Trainer Road, and I could get slightly different roll down results even after doing 2 consecutively. Apart from that Trainer Road software performed perfectly, and the support from them has been second to one.
As for the Kurt Kinetic InRide App ? Based on my experience and complete lack of support I would advise them to drop it altogether, just sell the magnet & sensor for $80 and let Trainer Road handle the software. Most people already have a HR strap and an accurate cadence sensor and dont need a bluetooth HR strap just so KK can justify the $200 price tag.
KK make really great trainers, the best IMO so perhaps best to stick with that !
Murph, I could not share your experience more. The original version of the app was actually pretty stable compared to the update which was just released, which has made training with this app now unfeasible. I am experiencing exactly the same issues you are with regards to power drifting and spindown calibrations never working.
lot’s of promise, needs a ton of work to be effective as a training tool.
DC Rainmaker’s review of the Garmin 705 is what led me to buy it…same when I decided to upgrade to the 800. I now have a Kinetic Rock and Roll on order and am looking at the inRide as a possible addition to my work out regimen. My wife and I have several bikes including recumbents.
I read above a lot different comments related to tire pressure. Will the inRide system work with all tires (pressures) or just high pressure road tires? Some of my tires ratings are no higher than 100, some 85. Don’t want to invest in this technology if it is for the high pressure crowd only. Thanks for any comments.
No issues there. And in many ways, that’s somewhat why the inRide exists. By doing a rolldown calibration, it can account for lower tire pressure – thus getting accurate power numbers at any given tire pressure.
Ray, What version of the InRIde app are you using ? I have had exactly the opposite experience to you, as have many others it seems.
I haven’t used it in a bit, though I was using the original version.
Your experience may be somewhat different with the current version. Something appears to gone awry with the updates which has led to the current version being basically unusable. Customer ‘support’ still haven’t replied, now going on 3 weeks.
Hmm, let me do some poking…
That would be super !!