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I don’t see a way for the bar itself to be strong given the top is a huge gap. I guess they could bond in the computers and make them structural but even then im unconvinced.
Personally I’d chalk this up to an investor scam. Come up with a good idea, get an early investor to buy in and expand, making it look legit, go to the markets and offload to public investors, walk away rich and watch it all burn from your yacht.
Hi Ray,
I was hoping that you would cover this product and I’m not disappointed!
Initially, as a tech geek, I liked the idea, but then I realized a simple thing – the handlebars would typically outlast the bike computer and looking at other startup bike computers tightly linked to their respective clouds, I don’t expect those to be supported for the lifetime of the handlebars themselves. Probably it would be couple of years of updates (at best) and then the company would either release a “new and improved” version, fully abandoning v1, or, more likely, will simply go extinct (like, say, Absolute One).
UI-wise the screenshots definitely look nice with clear Apple CarPlay vibes.
if you ever worked in consumer electronics or anything similar, you might know – making long lasting electronics is exponentially complex and expensive against longevity. and variety of other factors make it even worse. so one should NOT expect electronics longevity to be on par with metal pipe of handlebar.
Of course not but … this is for an environment. Where crashes etc take place. A large delicate exposed screen has been placed on what is effectively a relatively rigid pipe. If the bike goes down (high probability, with multiple other bikes and heavy people landing on it, the chances of major breakage is high assuming the handlebar survives at all. A Garmin will prob pop off the holder or the holder will snap under real force. Try different bal game. I’d hold my line on this one. It’s a nice idea but it hasn’t been though through and btw my experience with electronics is if it works in day one it’ll prob soldier on for years. The inbuilt obsolescent through lack of software support past a period in modern electronics is a big bear of mine.
Realistically, currently it would be easier and cheaper if you get a nice handlebar and glue a Garmin, a Wahoo, and a mobile phone to it.
If you want to be fancy, create a 3D-printed case for them.
Besides safety in the sense of “will it bend/break”, to me a key question here seems to be safety in the sense of “how many colorful and bright screens can you ignore to still look at the road”.
Already when using a large-screen garmin I find myself changing to a “boring” data page without colors and not changing too much in order to be less distracted and able to focus on traffic, enjoying the view etc.
This thing to me looks like the also crazier and crazier getting car dashboards or the giant screen in Teslas. No thanks ;-)
The picture revealing that it is just a slideshow also reveals that they seem to be using a raspberry pi or at least part of its software: the bar at the right (normally the top of the screen) is from Raspberry Pi OS desktop, including the logo in the top right ;-)
Yeah I noticed that logo too. They 100% have a raspberry pi hidden somewhere powering those dumb displays, likely a pi zero 2w for each individual display. Since it would make no sense to put raspberry pi OS on anything else not a pi, you would just use base debian.
Rather than a full handlebar they could do a more streamlined head unit with fairing to go over existing bars and stems. Though our friends at the UCI would probably have something to say about that.
No. Just no. I appreciate that without innovation there is no bike industry but this is really pushing out towards the classification of novelty item, which at the price makes it unviable. It’ll be heavy, it won’t flex (screens don’t like flex), if you have a bike fit and your set up it changes then your stuck… So many reasons why it’s a no. But that’s me, I’m keen to know if anyone else sees any future for this device.
maybe on a city bike. Or the weekend warrior that wishes they could ride their peleton out of the cul de sac.
Initially I thought, that looks cool.
No doubt someone would buy such a thing as said in the review.
But personally have a lot of reservations.
– It takes up loads of useful handlebar space. Garmins “larger” computers mount the other way likely for this reason.
– How much does it weigh?
– Obsolescence vs. the handlebar.
– The distraction !
It’s way too big for me to be honest, just like Garmins biggest units; I prefer the form factor of my Edge 840 even if I miss a few features and can’t get live segments to work on it. Don’t need a phone on my handlebars – if I did I could simply mount my actual phone there.
I attach my bike computer to a lot of bikes. Not keen to buy 5 of these ;O)
In principle, I always like innovative projects, including this one. However, I also have my doubts about a realistic implementation and a real need in the market. Especially when it comes to price/performance of the functions apart from the design.
What is also interesting about this project is the way it is funded, as the founder runs an OnlyFans account to raise money. You can think what you like about that. However, future investors must be aware of being associated with it.
Im following them for quite a while now. It’s also easier being German because the do more things in German i think.
I think its quite an interesting project: Its self funded, not investor funded. She has an engineering background from a sports car manufacturer, i think this is also an explanation why this much of display space is there.
They now do the carbon works literally in house.
The displays don’t „waste“ handlebar space because what would you want to mount to the handlebar when there is already a computer, a light and a bell integrated? You can grip all the usual places i use without problems.
What i see as caveats are mostly software things:
– How does it integrate into other smart systems? There are a lot of training planing platforms to support.
– How customizable will it be? What sensors are supported?
– How future proof is the whole thing? Not only in getting data out, but also in?
I think its a niche project for enthusiasts who can afford bikes like the Baldiso road bike she rides and wich was at the booth.
I never was aware of the Q2/26 time frame and now that i know it, i also don’t believe it will be there.
From the ergonomics standpoint I still think a type of relax climbing position using the tops will interfere with the screen if you use a 38 bar for example.. while being locked in with a wrong fit due to a cockpit is already painful and expensive, imagine in this case! you change bike and need a 10mm longer or shorter stem you can’t reuse your bar…
Wasn’t she Onlyfans star lol?
She’s both, she used/uses the onlyfans money to fund this
@Ray:
Im living in Germany and comment timestamps are 6h behind, is this on purpose?
Hello!
The timestamps are aligned to US East Coast time. Sorta always been that way, given the ‘DC’ part of DC Rainmaker.
That said, never really thought to see about simply having it enumerate your local time zone.
I just don’t see what problem this is trying to solve that isn’t better solved by either the Garmin 1050 or Wahoo Ace if you want a large bike computer display. How wide is the bike computer? I run 38cm bars, would there even be a “hands on top of the bar” position for me with this?
DCR is being very nice and professional here. The bottom line is run very, very far away from this mess. Whether it’s a scam or just totally naive people that don’t know what they’ve gotten themselves into, either way it won’t end up well for anyone that throws money at them.
Ok, it is already difficult enough to enter the crowded bike computer market and because you can’t offer feature parity as a small developer, so you must have some other key feature. Here, that seems to be the display size and integration.
While it looks sleek, I don’t think the integration is a plus point for the target audience. I don’t think that you will find these things on 1000 € Canyons in larger quantities, where people maybe don’t care too much about their seating position. Price wise, the company going for the S-Works and similar crowd. So after they already changed an expensive, fully integrated and aerodynamically very optimized OEM-cockpit after their professional bike fitting, they should buy this cockpit based on promises, that it will get future feature updates? I don’t know, I simply don’t see it.
It would be hard enough to build the bike computer part, but FliteDeck adds the handlebar and stem complication and can’t just hope that buyers will be happy with a one size fits all solution – the Roval Rapide Cockpit for example is available in 15 different length and width variations and that is already pretty limited. For a start-up, hat is pretty insane in every regard – development, testing, certification, moulds for production, inventory.
To be honest, I’m not entirely sure any more if her OF is to promote (and finance) the cockpit or the other way around.
The little kid in me says wow…I really really want that, the adult says, nah not in a million years
I ride my bike to get away from screens!
Sounds like a terrible idea to me.
You’re taking two things that are both very expensive *and* also have their own lifecycles and failure modes, and tying them together so that when one thing needs replacing, so does the other.
For the handle bar: it could fail mechanically, or it could need replacing because you decide you want something a bit different (e.g., for comfort, attachment compatibility, you got a different bike, whatever).
For the electronics: it could fail electronically (totally independent of mechanical failure), the battery will age, the software will eventually stop getting updates, or maybe you just can’t do what you need to with it (e.g., integration with other platforms, whatever). If there’s one thing you can be sure of, it’s that this stuff will become obsolete.
Now when any one of these things happens, you have to replace the whole thing! Not fun. Keep things modular unless they really share a common lifecycle.
For a pro racing team where they’re adding weight to hit the minimum and aero is more of a concern than longevity (in terms of product cycles), once the software is mature, maybe. If the team gets them free from sponsorship, sure.
For the average amateur racer/bike rider. Nah.
For a bike enthusiast with money to burn on their hobby and they already have the latest and greatest $25k frame, maybe (once the software is mature).
For me, I don’t ever see it happening (aside from winning a billion dollar lottery and moving up into the category above).
If you had the software and electronics side solved, it would actually be quite easy to abandon the “quarter turn on out-front-mount” pattern and combine a thin screen-only area to sit neatly on top of a bar/stem/barstem with battery/PCB/headlight in a bulge that goes before the bar. No need to go fully integrated, just design some neat somewhat flexible rigging to go below the bar/stem, it would be a three point setup, no tight clamping force required at all.
But they chose to go all in, likely because otherwise they’d have to face the reality that software and electronics are hard, instead of tinkering with carbon bar building instead.
They could also install a smartphone in the handlebars. When I go to a restaurant, I put my bike on the table!
I have three bikes that I ride regularly, so no, not a chance.
Have you seen their instagram? They seem more engaged on showing boobs than actual product development. It’s desperate. I wouldn’t count on this ever seeing the light of day.
Car manufacturers have eliminated proprietary navigation systems because there’s no way they can keep up with the innovation and update cycle of phone mapping systems. That should be a clue. Expecting a company like this to have software competitive with Garmin or Google or Apple is…unrealistic.
What MIGHT make sense is to have handlebars with a huge configurable display, and work with the bike computer and phone companies to have it work as a remote monitor. Your phone and/or head unit would be the computational engines and you’d have a huge bright display of whatever screens and data fields you wanted.
This exactly. CarPlay and Android auto do the removing by Bluetooth and then you just need to have the app stores manage software updates … partner with RWGPS or another presence who wants to get into the bigger space and you have a winner. The screen hardware tech can be simply made to be a mirror and last 5+ years.
In the past the slow movers of integrated GPS systems with data got outpaced by hardware in the wider market (phones) and this is a way the phone can replace the bike computer too, but safely in a back pocket or bag.
Saying noone wants a big screen real estate is just not following trends- what becomes the norm in a car or just having a phone bigger than a ”who needs bigger than 4inch” is what will be expected and someone needs to just do it right, either integrated or ¼-turn remote screen.
To be fair though, the industry trend in cars is actually going the opposite direction now (with companies going away from CarPlay & Android Auto).
A bit of an explainer: link to motortrend.com
Having a dedicated display for map & data is appealing but can achieve that at a lower price point.
Tandem stoker may find some value.
Would definitely need to be able to adjust the display angle for bright-sun days.
Thanks for reporting on this project that clearly came with a ton of skepticisms and completely agree on your summary, this project should be way more advanced before even making it public.
Electronic aside, the ergonomics are super questionable, you can almost ignore using the top hands position.
Thanks for the article! As others before me, I don’t see a strong use case for people using multiple bikes. Inasmuch as the existing technology provides more information to the rider than is necessary for most people (especially while riding). I also don’t think that the danger of structural failure can be had waves of because it is a German company. Because a.) if something really bad happens, this Startup simply folds and there is probably not enough insurance coverage or assets compared to a bigger company (which -in theory at least-you could sue blind) to make up for damages. And b.) Though not strictly comparable… as far as I know (and here I could be wrong) Jonas Schomburgs Aerobars/Cockpit as seen on IM Frankfurt last Sunday was also designed and made in Germany….
Hand waved hot had waved… aaaargh
Stop telling nonsense. Jonas Schomburg was riding a fastTT cockpit. This company is definitely what you said: It’s a LTD with low monetary assets. They are „proudly based in New Zealand“ according to their website.
By the way, fastTT are known for their dendency to separate if you use them with only pillar. Seems that they use a conus as connection wich can’t be clamped correctly what is now heard in the Instagram bubble.
Jonas is with a German Bikefitter to 3d Print a new solution for Challenge Roth, search for Radsport Ibert if you are interested.
Hey! Thanks for the information. Still not interested in the product. One more thing, that may apply to some people’s attitude… it’s an old German saying: “Wohl mit dem D-Zug durch die Kinderstube gefahren…“. Enjoy the weekend.
Unfortunately this looks like a pretty weak progress. While I understand this type of work seems extremely difficult for people outside of embedded HW/SW business, reaching basic touch screen capability with simple user interaction is not really a big mountain to climb for a bunch of professionals. Doesn’t look like they have the right resources to pull this off – surely now it doesn’t look like being the case.
I’ve been following this project from the very beginning, and I’m getting more and more indications that it might actually be a big scam.
From the graphics it looks like it’s going to be an Android platform, so you’ll probably have to use phone data to be able to run most of the apps if not all, so it so much a bike computer and more like a stripped down phone, I can’t see them developing a new sys op so any apps on it will be proprietary and if you want to track your ride you would have to hope they built that in.
Seems a classic case of ‘Fake it until you Make it’
I doesn’t make sense to built a cycling computer into a handlebar.
* Total weight increase according to their statements.
* Replacing yourself the battery is not possible according to their statements.
* Replacement of cycling computer or handlebar requires now replacing both at once.
* Congratulations: You lost the ability to mount your cycling computer onto another bike. Previously you needed one for all. Now every bike needs one.
Their rationale for the integration is wrong. They argue that items on the handlebar are clutter. Their neglecting the existing of outfront mounts for Garmin/Wahoo and three nose adapters below and the ability to quickly add/remove equipment with rubberbands.
Red Flags:
* As far as I know that didn’t had hired any programmer in autumn last year.
* As German…I don’t trust startups from Munich. Sorry :)
You forgot the completely unrealistic timeline, the unbelievable claims about pre-orders, and the fact that one of the founders makes her money on OF.
I am surprised you actually looked at this. If you had visited their website some time ago, the mix of porn and bike was astounding (some is still on their IG site). Even if this worked, I doubt it would make lots of sense, let alone at that price.
Which leads me to a relatively unrelated question: why haven’t you reviewed the Insta360 X4 camera so far? You have reviewed every single GoPro and I read your rant about the Insta promotion stunts- seems like one more reason for an unbiased review…
“why haven’t you reviewed the Insta360 X4 camera so far?”
Setting aside the X5 is the current edition…(which, they acutally sent over), honestly, nobody watches the videos. I cover the Insta360 non-360 cams (e.g. Ace Pro, Ace Pro 2, Go series, etc…), because there’s legit interest there, mainly just from people considering buying GoPro/DJI cameras.
But as you noted, Insta360 floods the media with cameras (some 1,300 cameras were sent out for example, as an exec noted last year). The problem is, doing 360 camera reviews take an insane amount of time/editing, and yet, the views on these are absolutely trivial. Even the most popular creators with millions of subscribers were averaging low tens of thousands at best in the weeks since launch.
It’s true, countless amounts of that is influencer paid junk to sift through. I have no problem with companies sending out review units to reputable media to review. And honestly, I have no problem if a company sends out units to influencers, as long as they don’t tell them to mark it as a review (or review like content). But otherwise, for someone like me trying to make non-sponsored reviews, I’d throw tons of effort into it, and my time could have been better spend doing 2-3 other sports tech device reviews.
General rule of thumb for action cam reviews is they take 2-4x the time of anything else (except something like a Fenix/etc multisport device, which take longer due to all the scenarios). And that’s regular action cam reviews, 360 action cam reviews…hurt my head.
So yeah, that’s roughly where I stand. I’ve been playing with the X5, and maybe I’ll do something later this summer (they finally got the X5 underwater case released).
As someone who owns and last used a VIRB 360 a couple of days ago, IMHO the reason 360 isn’t popular is simple. It’s hard to share. I took my 360 to see if I could catch the last of the 17 year cicada brood that emerged here. (In short, I neither heard nor saw any cicadas, and I deliberately went where I saw and heard them the previous week. The sounds that 17 year cicadas make are eerie and loud, and if they were around their carcasses would be all over the road.) If I wanted to share something from that video, I’d have to go through extra effort, in part due to the age of the hardware and software, in part due to the 360 nature. Contrast that with the video I took with my GoPro Hero 13 a day before that. During the ride (in Time Warp) I came across a black bear, the first and probably last I’ll see this year. Got it on video, immediately shared the entire video to Facebook after it uploaded to the GoPro cloud, and later used Handbrake to cut out the bear clip and shared that. Of course, if the bear had been off to the side, I wouldn’t have captured it. With 360 you get all of the shots automatically.
The only place I know where I could share 360 video is YouTube, and even there you have to mark it as 360, using their “Spatial Media Metadata Injector”. Otherwise people simply don’t have the software to view 360 video properly.
Dear Ray, thanks for your answer -much appreciated- and understood. I see 360 clips on Strava and Reddit and I find them amazing. But I get it’s too much of a niche and at the same time oversaturated market.
Hope you’ll do a short note on the x5
Ya, this seems ridiculous. A Garmin 1050 even looks cooler and definitely works better.
Dear Ray,
that bike computer reminded me of the Omata one, which I always found very intriguing (besides the price). It is also on your X header image. So I wondered if you know anything about this project?
Kind regards
Hannes
Yeah, I haven’t heard from them in countless years (since launch). Obviously their social media acocunt (Instagram) publishes once or twice per year, but you can’t otherwise buy the product best I know. Not sure if it’s just them trying to keep appearances looking online or whatever.
Ultiamtely, it was always kinda funky and the unit I had didn’t work super well, such that I had shelved it, and then by time I came back to look at it again, things went silent.
But…that is a good reminder that header definitely needs a refresh!
Thank you for the update. That does not sound so well.
It reduces hand placement options massively on the bar. Its more likely to get broken. The price is outrageous for something that will need to be updated regularly and could get damaged in a crash quite easily. You’re carrying extra weight for what? Sure a long distance tourist might be interested in all the info but they also need the hand placement options which are arguably mor important. Its not ultimately giving you much more than a Garmin bike computer plus phone or watch. This is not well thought through at all in terms of target market/use case.
I wouldn’t invest or buy and use it.
The best use because of the huge screen would be a rear-view mirror function. Cyclists would like to see what is happening behind them and there is still no satisfactory solution for this. The image would of course be projected onto the handlebars by a high-tech micro camera, let alone during a bike race where you can immediately see who is about to attack from behind.
thos is hopelessly retarded and useless. Wear a pair of AR glasses. And i am only talking about thpse that project the screen from your phone. I have tried it for youtubing informative video while cycling. So i assume you can use it for other training metrics.
Yeah, no I don’t see this being a thing that will last. Sure someone will purchase while the majority will sit back and wait to see how it works for them and if it fails or succeeds but in reality it’s more a gimmick than a necessity
I prefer to have hand position choices on my handlebars, this tech limits the choices considerably. It is not for me.
Bike computer on a mount, out in front, happy place 👍🏼
This smells like that iqsquare powermeter…
Innovation by integrating these two already functioning items seems wildly unnecessary to me. It looks like it would be far easier for Garmin or another computer company to partner with a handlebar company and make a handlebar that integrates the computer into the “cockpit”. The bike computer is one of the only things that I can easily switch from one bike to another, and it’s also one of the few items I only have to replace every 5 years—obviously, barring any wreck, theft etc.
Ludicrous idea. Anyone throwing their hard-earned at this madness should probably be committed to an institution.